How do you solve a problem like corruption within the juries?

Tisch

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With the bizarre situation of 6 jurors from semi 2 being banned, and three of those ending up with some (sort of) made-up jury scores, what can we do to improve this going forward?

Some things that spring to my mind:

- Increase the size of the juries - at the moment half of the scores are decided by 200 people. If we double this, we reduce the chance of cross-contamination between them

- In addition to this, maybe SOMETHING like only choosing 5 juror's scores at random to use, and the jurors therefore don't know if their score will be used or not. Likewise, discourages the use of any big bags of money if it's not definite that those scores will be used...

- QUESTION: Are the jurors together when they watch the performances? Because they should be isolated, and not allowed to discuss where they think certain points should be allocated.

- Not fully related but I'm also struggling with the juror score weighting (which, again would be improved with a looser conglomerate of jurors). I know this changed in 2018(?) and reasons were given, but looking at Romania's jury vote, Finland were given one 4th, and four positions in the 20's. The 4th has massively outweighed the 20's and they end up with jury points. There would be less need to bribe individual jurors if their points mattered less than that.

- Lastly - if a juror's scores are wildly out of touch with other countries'/televotes/general opinion, a quick interview as to WHY couldn't hurt. I'm all for various jurors having various opinions, but if they're as professional as they should be, they should also be happy to back these up. (:opinion:)
 

Sheena

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Also, jurors need to not necessarily be famous people. That's always IRKED me.

Whilst it also shouldn't just be "random" members of the public, I don't see why real fans shouldn't be included.
 

Sheena

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Or at least ban anyone for the following contest who appears to break the rules. That'll stop them fannying about.
 
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I was thinking that having another real country jury for the purpose of backup would pretty much solve this and any other problems (ie what if one of the 5 needs to go the hospital mid through?). And also I don't know how the selection of juries happens, but ideally, I would like the broadcaster to submit the candidates with their CVs and the EBU to screen them, hold the interviews, and the make the final choice and OWN the results like a grown-up without this ridicule.
 

Madison

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Some more transparency on the rules would be good. Do we know the criteria given to the jurors, or how jurors are selected these days?

In subjective sports, they often ditch the highest and lowest vote and take the average of the remaining jurors. If the jury were expanded, they could implement that easily. (I wish we did this more often on Moopy).
 
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I can find the criteria for the jurors cause I remember reading it pre contest and thinking that it is very vague.
Give me a second and I'll edit the post to include it.

It's not the actual source I remember reading but it's the same 4 criteria:
- the vocal capacity of the artist(s)
- the performance on stage
- the composition and originality of the song
- the overall impression by the act

source: https://eurovision.tv/about/voting
 
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Sheena

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Azerbaijan are irritating with it too - they send generally quite average songs, so it isn't clear what they are trying to achieve by arsing about so much.

Enough to beat Armenia?
 

Alias #23

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Azerbaijan are irritating with it too - they send generally quite average songs, so it isn't clear what they are trying to achieve by arsing about so much.
:D Not including DIHAJ OBVIOUSLY

Or indeed most of them, having just looked at Wikipedia :eyes:

I know this one was shitty live but SHALL WE? :disco:

 

Kratz

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:D Not including DIHAJ OBVIOUSLY

Or indeed most of them, having just looked at Wikipedia :eyes:

I know this one was shitty live but SHALL WE? :disco:


Oh don't get me wrong, when they're good they are GREAT! Mata Hari, Miracle, Skeletons, X My Heart...but fewer male ballads please.

I just don't understand why you would rig the jury this year of all years, with that dirge...at least do it with a banger.
 
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Wouldn't Cyprus be disqualified straight away if this was the case?
And would they be allowed to announce their votes normally as if nothing happened when 6 countries weren't? It doesn't make sense 🤷‍♂️
 

Soldi

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I’ve never said it was the TRUTH :evil: also when have I spread fake news before? :angry:
 

dmlaw

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I hope the EBU have some convincing evidence of the jury corruption. If they don’t, and quite possibly even if they do, we might find ourselves a few countries short for next year.
 

Kratz

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How DARE YOU!
Ha. What I meant to say is why are the rigging (allegedly!) the votes for their more average entries :D

You know my tastes enough to appreciate that I fully STAN them
 

Alla

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I just don't understand why you would rig the jury this year of all years, with that dirge...at least do it with a banger.
With a banger they don't need to rig anything, I guess.

I think we're gonna miss some countries next year, either banned or not bothering with this farce anymore.
 
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I hope the EBU have some convincing evidence of the jury corruption. If they don’t, and quite possibly even if they do, we might find ourselves a few countries short for next year.
Am worried this is now bound to happen either way, with or without evidence.
 

Kratz

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I’d caution against drawing conclusions too quickly - the EBU has often been accused of being too slow to react, or even react at all, to some relatively transparent mischief in the past. There must have been reasons which, on balance, caused it to act as it did this year and on previous form those reasons must have been quite serious. I am not sure countries, jurors etc. now jumping up and down on Twitter heralding apparent real jury votes is in and of itself that material. Unless I am missing something.
 
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Perhaps we won't lose anyone at all.
Poland 🇵🇱 and San Marino 🇸🇲 have already confirmed their intention to participate next year.
Along with Austria 🇦🇹, Cyprus 🇨🇾, Finland 🇫🇮, Israel 🇮🇱, Netherlands 🇳🇱 and Spain 🇪🇸.
 

Alla

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I’d caution against drawing conclusions too quickly - the EBU has often been accused of being too slow to react, or even react at all, to some relatively transparent mischief in the past. There must have been reasons which, on balance, caused it to act as it did this year and on previous form those reasons must have been quite serious. I am not sure countries, jurors etc. now jumping up and down on Twitter heralding apparent real jury votes is in and of itself that material. Unless I am missing something.
There is no way the EBU is going to change the votes of SIX countries without clear evidence, because the scadal after the final is inevitable. The question is if they'll take further actions, I wouldn't understand if this is it after something so serious, because this is truly a farce if so.
 

Sheena

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I’m not sure why we are we all questioning whether it’s justified when it’s even been REALLY FUCKING OBVIOUS before now and they’ve done nothing about it and we’ve all moaned!
 
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Penelope

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I suspect Sugar last year was quite influential in this regard. Very obviously had some funny business going on with its semi vote.
 

Soldi

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Did Sugar get ANY legitimate points (away from Romania) last year?!
 

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