Modern art - SHIT OR NOT SHIT

As a CONCEPT


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Penelope

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This seems to have STIRRED SOME HORROR in the Eurovision forum so it makes sense as a full topic :horny:

Anyway, back in the 1910s Marcel Duchamp (the original Lady Gaga) decried his contemporaries as a load of BASIC BITCHES by saying they were obsessed only with 'retinal' art, which sought only to please the eye and do nothing else. Duchamp believed that art should just as much serve the mind, so he promptly changed the game by turning a urinal upside down, declaring it ART (and in FAIRNESS, it did look very pretty, so why shouldn't it be? :)), pissing off a load of people and setting off a revolution, the consequences of which we're still living with today.

Over a century later, gammons (and @ButterTart) ACROSS THE GLOBE whinge incessantly about the Lady Gaga album 'ARTPOP' and the Turner Prize (not to be mistaken with former self-loathing Moopy member @TurnerPrize), decrying them as a load of worthless pretentious old nonsense. So - HOW DOES THE CONCEPT stand up for you? :disco:
 
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COB

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Me running in to click yes on the poll
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COB

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The Gallery of Modern Art here is one of my favourite places to visit.
 

Ag

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I like ALL KINDS OF ART, but probably find myself most drawn to anything produced since the late Victorian era. Things started getting interesting once opium was introduced into things.
 

ButterTart

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Both, there’s good and bad though some shit gets passed off as “you just don’t get it” when it’s clearly just crap.
This is why I think modern art is a con. If a painting of a horse is shit, it's just a shit painting of a horse. If a lazy hack shits on a bit of plywood, anyone who doesn't fawn over it is somehow 'not getting it'. I've seen some nice, interesting stuff, but I've seen some shit that took five seconds and somehow found its way into a national gallery.
 

Penelope

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I will note that it's the far right (particularly the likes of Thierry Baudet, but also Trump when one of the few pledges you could get out of him for what he'd do if he won 2020 was 'restore beauty and classical style buildings to our cities') that most prominently leads the way in trying to rile a movement against modern art and returning to pre-20th century classical notions of it. There's a hell of a load of politics in it, much as it might not seem!
 

RaspberrySwirl

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The kind of modern art that I dislike is pop art and that kind of shit.

Give me colourful geometrical figures or something really abstract but I don’t want to see no goddamn soup cans on my walls.
 

Ag

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Obviously we're all VERY QUALIFIED to validly discuss such BROAD CONCEPTS.
 

Penelope

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This is why I think modern art is a con. If a painting of a horse is shit, it's just a shit painting of a horse. If a lazy hack shits on a bit of plywood, anyone who doesn't fawn over it is somehow 'not getting it'. I've seen some nice, interesting stuff, but I've seen some shit that took five seconds and somehow found its way into a national gallery.
Well yeah, but surely the crucial points are a. whether the point itself is valid and/or b. whether the art itself does a good job of conveying the point? The ultimate answer is "I get it - it's just not a good metaphor for that / the point is shit / it's not good at causing the feeling it sets out to create"

Of course, the other debate is over whether art should always be enjoyable! (NO :disco:)
 

RaspberrySwirl

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I will note that it's the far right (particularly the likes of Thierry Baudet, but also Trump when one of the few pledges you could get out of him for what he'd do if he won 2020 was 'restore beauty and classical style buildings to our cities') that most prominently leads the way in trying to rile a movement against modern art and returning to pre-20th century classical notions of it. There's a hell of a load of politics in it, much as it might not seem!

They really do love anything neo-classist architecturw (which is not bad) but it’s really something they all seem to have in common.
 

Penelope

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Thing is, I do love a bit of neoclassical and Georgian architecture from time to time. But London's the greatest city in the world because there's such a glorious MIX OF EVERYTHING :disco:

MORE BRUTALISM! MORE GEORGIAN ARCHITECTURE! MORE LUDICROUS HYPERMODERN OFFICE BUILDINGS THAT LOOK LIKE THE PHYSICAL MANIFESTATION OF A SOPHIE SONG!
 

RaspberrySwirl

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Thing is, I do love a bit of neoclassical and Georgian architecture from time to time. But London's the greatest city in the world because there's such a glorious MIX OF EVERYTHING :disco:

MORE BRUTALISM! MORE GEORGIAN ARCHITECTURE! MORE LUDICROUS HYPERMODERN OFFICE BUILDINGS THAT LOOK LIKE THE PHYSICAL MANIFESTATION OF A SOPHIE SONG!

Well yes, and no, they have to fit in and not stick out like sore thumbs.
 

ButterTart

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Well yeah, but surely the crucial points are a. whether the point itself is valid and/or b. whether the art itself does a good job of conveying the point? The ultimate answer is "I get it - it's just not a good metaphor for that / the point is shit / it's not good at causing the feeling it sets out to create"

Of course, the other debate is over whether art should always be enjoyable! (NO :disco:)
I don't expect art to be enjoyable, I just prefer to go to a proper art gallery and be bored while thinking 'that's quite nice, he was a good painter', as opposed to going to a modern art gallery to be bored and think 'I could have done that'.

There are definitely some pieces I really like, e.g. 364 Suisses Morts, because it looks like a bit of effort went into it.
51d0a-boltanskiberardo.jpg


And then, on the other hand, there's a stack of printed paper with some circles on, which is just lazy and meaningless.
T13309_9.jpg
 

Penelope

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I don't expect art to be enjoyable, I just prefer to go to a proper art gallery and be bored while thinking 'that's quite nice, he was a good painter', as opposed to going to a modern art gallery to be bored and think 'I could have done that'.
You could have. BUT YOU DIDN'T!
 

Ag

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Thankfully we have a modern art gallery here now, which can be QUITE GOOD.

Galleries and museums are high on my list of things to do once this particular ART PROJECT is over.
 

ButterTart

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I think it hardly needs saying that of course there’s GOOD and BAD modern art. And as for the ‘I could’ve done that’ argument, well YOU DIDN’T.
Not very inspirational, is it? I suppose the other argument is that I'd never draw a circle on a bit of paper and consider it art in the first place.
 

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